Of Joseph Prince and “His” defenders

When The Blind Lead The Blind, Shall They Not Fall Into The Ditch?

You may also like to read:

• Joseph Prince Double-speak lies about Holy Spirit
• Caution: "Destined to Reign" by Joseph Prince 
• Joseph Prince of This World 
• Honest Review of "Destined to Reign" 

Do you know why I had put “His” above in a capital letter?  Well, it does look like he is a god and idol to his believers. They will struggle to defend him with drilled-in clichés, and statements.  I see exactly the same behavior in the Jehovah Witnesses and Mormons who come to my door.  It is always something like this,

" Noo! you do not seem to understand what he is saying ..." or  "Ohh! you must listen to the complete sermon first". And when you say you have done so, they counter,  "Have you finished listening to the whole series?"

Sounds familiar? That is a standard cult respond technique!  Try talking to any Jehovah Witness and you will know.

I have often been asked about Joseph Prince.  Sandy just did so, too last Thursday.  “What do you think about Joseph Prince”?  And I will usually reply in these terms, “He’s a false teacher.  Be careful.  He mixes truths with untruths, confuses you by saying contradictory things on the same topic in different ways so that you will believe both positions without questioning further”.

Anyway, today while googling for “Ananias” and “Saphira” for information, I came across this blog, Daniel's Place, with this article “Joseph Prince vs the Bible”, which speaks out against his ( small h because Daniel is not his believer ); and this one, A Review Of A Book Review (Destined To Reign), His believer who wrote a well-written doting review of a horrible book.

These are the things that dawned on me about the doting believers in their god:

1)     They do not know how to catch those contradictory positions, because Joseph Prince is a good speaker and masterful with words

2)     They have blinkered understanding of scriptures, their understanding having been confined to what their god has said

3)     They also possess the canned definition of biblical terms and phrases, drilled into their heads by false teachers – not being of the Holy Spirit.

Ananias and Saphira and the Joseph Prince Boo-boo

Let’s talk about Ananias and Saphira ( Acts 5) and see how the defenders defend their mighty god.  On page 57 of his book Destined to Reign ( please don’t buy, just borrow a copy from one of the unfortunate souls who did ), Joseph Prince – an international pulpit speaker with a following of tens of thousands had this to say to the question in italics:

    “But Pastor Prince, didn’t God punish King David for his sin and he lost his child?”

    Don’t forget that David, like Elijah, lived before the cross of Jesus. You will never find an example of God punishing a believer for his sins in the new covenant.  Let’s study the scriptures for ourselves and not just go by what other people are saying.

The above is reproduced without errors and omissions.

Well, he obviously does not read the bible and did not know about Ananias and Saphira episode.  What?? An international preacher who does not read the bible?  Cari makan ma!  (just earning a living ) What a boo-boo for an international bible “teacher”.  Maybe someone has pointed it out to him by now and he is desperately trying, or has given up trying to find a way to properly explain that boo-boo.  Why, even many of the new believers I asked can immediately answer that God did punish Ananias and Saphira under the new covenant.

KingDavid Blog Tries To Rescue His god

Well, Joseph Prince does not have to worry.  His doting believers will come to his rescue!  So here's the idiot well-writen bad review of his god’s book that goes: 

Malcolm has written a good post comparing Ananias of Acts 5 and Ananias of Acts 9, see here.  From the Bible, the Ananias of Acts 9 was descibed as “there was a disciple named Ananias” but the Ananias of Acts 5 was descibed as “But there was a certain man named Ananias who,”  Comparing it side-by-side, the subtle difference is as night & day; a disciple verse a certain man. In addition, notice also the But in Acts 5; that will mean that it is contrasting to a previous subject. So let’s go back to Acts 4, and we see this: For instance, there was Joseph, the one the apostles nicknamed Barnabas (which means “Son of Encouragement”). He was from the tribe of Levi and came from the island of Cyprus. He sold a field he owned and brought the money to the apostles. Acts 4:36-37   The apostles had apparently endorsed this Joseph, thus, I am very certain that Ananias and Sapphira were not true believers. ( Emphasis are mine )

If the above logic is correct, then we must also conclude that when the bible says “there was a certain man”, it is means that he subsequently changed his sex, or that Joseph was Joseph only for a time!  See the semantic inconsistency?  Acrobatics with words. That’s what blind believers and false teachers do.  Idol worshipers argue for the sake of defending their god and idol, not on truth and logic.  The error he made is so bad that his disciple must now twist the scripture to say that Ananias and Saphira are not believers!  How desperate!

KingDavid Blog Makes Another Vain Defence

In the passage immediately following the above, the writer continues, ( in his effort to defend his god’s doctrine of superabundant grace ):

Although a common ideology, I cannot find it anywhere in the Bible that says the Holy Spirit convicts believers of their sin ( emphasis mine ). What I found is this: because our gospel came to you not simply with words, but also with power, with the Holy Spirit and with deep conviction. 1 Thessalonians 1:4 (NIV)  but when I checked the other translation, I like it better: For when we brought you the Good News, it was not only with words but also with power, for the Holy Spirit gave you full assurance that what we said was true.  1 Thessalonians 1:4 (NLT)  The conviction here is actually of comforting assurance, how lovely.

The false teacher does not know, and his believer naturally does not know. And further you marvel at the comments of the readers of KingDavid blog, with their doting comments.  Jesus said, “Can the blind lead the blind? Will they not both fall into the ditch?”.

Why did the author of the blog need to make such a fool of himself?  It is because his god wrote in page 134 of that horrible book, Destined to Reign, these words:

The bottom line is the Holy Spirit never convicts you of your sins. He NEVER comes to point out your faults.  I challenge you to find a scripture in the bible that the Holy Spirit has come to convict you of your sins.  You won’t find any.  (Emboldened and CAPITALISED in the original )

Okay-lah then, I meet your challenge-lah!   It is in Joh 16:8-lah, bodoh!:

And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:

That is what happens when Christians become followers of man and not God.  Observe that the above review writer is a scripture-quoting Christian who also has an excellent command of the English language.  This is why I say that Joseph Prince is so smooth with his words that he can encourage you to sin on the one hand without you feeling convicted if you agree, then at the same time preach that a true believer will live a holy life.  This is what a false preacher is good at, and fools will come to his defense.

What about LLC

Like others, this fellow is a sincere believer of Jesus, and a Joseph Prince fan.  He struggles to sort out his confused state of understanding, gropes for words to defend his idol and expresses some frustration, demands the writer Daniel refrain from saying certain things,  but finally he came to terms somewhat with the stand of Daniel against false teachings.  I think he able to come to that stage because he has not been mesmerized too much, not being a member of the church of that false teacher.

As for the other defenders of their god, like that guy Phil, I leave you to read his efforts at defending his god for yourself.  He just cannot see through the double-speak preaching of Joseph Prince, slippery and 2-edged.

But Daniel has got it right about Joseph Prince.

A good church is not measured by the size of its membership, the charisma of its pastor, much less the beauty, completeness of facilities and comfort of its building.  It is measured by the truth that it preaches, that does not lead you to stray away from the Lord even as you think you are following Him.  For surely, 

Mat 7:13  Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

Your choice.

Jesus says in John 8:32, "And ye shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free."

Ye Shall Not Surely Die Part 4 - Unbiblical Christianity

Once Saved Forever Saved? The bible says you lie!

Read also:

• Part 1
• Part 2
• Part 3 

The doctrine of eternal security goes so far as to say that once a person has been saved, by sincerely saying the sinner’s prayer, he cannot lose his salvation ever.  Even if he denies Jesus or continues to commit adultery blatantly or practice sorcery, God is able to keep him by his power of salvation.  And those that the Father gives to Jesus, Jesus says nobody can snatch any out of his hands.  Really?  Let’s look at the bible for examples.

1)      Judas

Judas was definitely a believer.  Judas was handpicked by Jesus to be one of the 12 apostles.  Together with the others, he was anointed with the power and sent out by Jesus twice to preach the gospel of the Kingdom.  He was able to perform healing and cast out demons by the power of the Holy Spirit. 

The bible clearly says that Judas has been lost, even though he was given to Jesus by the Father

Joh 17:12  While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled

Does this not clearly show that once a person denies Jesus, he has removed himself out of the will of the Father, and off to hell he goes. A believer can turn into a son of perdition! This is by far the clearest example of a believer, an apostle even going to hell.

2)      Hermeneus, Alexander and Philetus

These 3 were very probably teachers and leaders.  And they were leading people astray with their words, vain babblings and teachings to the extent of shipwrecking their faith.  Let see these few verses :

2Ti 2:17  And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus; 2Ti 2:18  Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.  2Ti 2:19  Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

1Ti 1:18  This charge I commit unto thee, son Timothy, according to the prophecies which went before on thee, that thou by them mightest war a good warfare;  1Ti 1:19  Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some having put away concerning faith have made shipwreck:  1Ti 1:20  Of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander; whom I have delivered unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme.

Weren’t they believers?  They were!  And does Paul sound like he is saying they can still be saved despite their erroneous ways and blasphemy? Surely being “delivered unto Satan”  can only mean condemnation.

3)      Diotrephes

Diotrephes was a believer and a church leader of whom we do not know much, save for what John tells us about him:

3Jn 1:9  I wrote unto the church: but Diotrephes, who loveth to have the preeminence among them, receiveth us not. 3Jn 1:10  Wherefore, if I come, I will remember his deeds which he doeth, prating against us with malicious words: and not content therewith, neither doth he himself receive the brethren, and forbiddeth them that would, and casteth them out of the church.  3Jn 1:11  Beloved, follow not that which is evil, but that which is good. He that doeth good is of God: but he that doeth evil hath not seen God.

John urges the other believers not to follow the evil ways of Diotrephes because he that is evil has not seen God.  Again, does it look like Diotrephes is going to heaven, unless he turns away from evil?

4)      Ananias and Saphira

Luke relates to us the record of this husband and wife couple in Acts 5, where they sold their property and brought the money to the feet of Peter, to support church life.  So, they were definitely believers, committed enough to sell their property and give the money for the benefit of believers.  However, they did not give truthfully, pretending that they had given all when in fact they had kept back a part of the money.  For this sin of deceit, they died at the words of Peter who said they had lied to God. 

Shall we argue that they are going to heaven to be with God?

And while on these 2 persons, I cannot resist the opportunity to mention that the false teacher Joseph Prince definitely has not read Acts chapter 5.  On page 57 & 58 of his book “Destined to Reign”, he revealed his ignorance of the bible by asking the reader to prove that God had ever punished any New Testament believer who is under grace.  Big names often speak nonsense and write nonsense; which is why I always tell people “Stop reading books that explain the bible, read the bible!”

5)      Saul

1Sa 11:6   tells us the Spirit of God had came upon Saul.  And 1 Samuel 16:14 tell us that the Spirit of God departed from Saul. A person anointed by the Holy Spirit can still lose the anointing and the Spirit leaves him!

Do you think Saul is in heaven after showing himself so disobedient to God?

We can still talk about Adam and Eve, and their son Cain.  In the same vein, they were worshippers of the great Creator God.  The bible clearly says that death came through Adam.  If Adam’s death is purely bodily death, does Jesus need to come to die and live that all may live?

How do the “Once Saved Forever Saved” proponents respond to the above?  There are 2 common ways, the most popular of which is:

“Oh, these people were not really saved from the beginning”, and the other is to ignore these scriptures and continue to push to you their “proof verses”.

As I often countered the Jehovah Witnesses who come to my house, “If you can only push your explanation for your proof verses, while you are being unable to explain, or choose to ignore the other scriptural verses that run counter to your proof verses, something is surely wrong!  Either your explanation is wrong or the bible is self-contradictory, inconsistent and unreliable!”

Jesus made it very clear when He explained:

Mat 7:21  Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.  Mat 7:22  Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?  Mat 7:23  And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

These people call Jesus “Lord”, meaning they are believers and followers. These people were empowered by the Holy Spirit to perform miracles and signs and wonders.  These believers were expecting to be received by Jesus to enter into the Kingdom of God, but were rejected.

So,  do you still want to hold on to your belief that you can be a sinful, lying, disobedient, unrepentant follower of Jesus and still enter into his Kingdom?

And did not Jesus say:

Joh 8:32  And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free